True Crucian?

[NoCarpPlease]

Over the years I've caught very few crucian carp.

Most were from an old "estate lake" at Tingrith in Bedfordshire ... back in the 80s. There were also plenty of carp (wildie shaped) in that lake, but the crucians were very different - with a much deeper curve in the belly (as well as the dorsal side) and laterally flatter. It was before all of the controversy over hybridisation, but I don't recall catching any "inbetween" looking fish ... the carp and crucians were very distinct.

The last two that I caught were about ten years ago - from the Grand Union Canal at Small Heath. Again the rounding on both dorsal and belly and laterally flattened, those two were distinctly green.

None of them were over 12oz or so ...

So my vote would be the first two photos are as close to true crucians as you can get without doing an autopsy!

 

[Tinca Steve]

Over the years I've caught very few crucian carp.

Most were from an old "estate lake" at Tingrith in Bedfordshire ... back in the 80s. There were also plenty of carp (wildie shaped) in that lake, but the crucians were very different - with a much deeper curve in the belly (as well as the dorsal side) and laterally flatter. It was before all of the controversy over hybridisation, but I don't recall catching any "inbetween" looking fish ... the carp and crucians were very distinct.

The last two that I caught were about ten years ago - from the Grand Union Canal at Small Heath. Again the rounding on both dorsal and belly and laterally flattened, those two were distinctly green.

None of them were over 12oz or so ...

So my vote would be the first two photos are as close to true crucians as you can get without doing an autopsy!

They can do DNA tests now. Just need a couple of scales.

 

[Deejay8]

The thing to remember is that crucians and carp can hybridize, but the hybrid offspring will mostly be infertile. So as long as the carp are breeding with other carp, and the crucians are breeding with other crucians, as well as sometimes with each other, then the population of both carp and crucians should remain viable, and the hybrids won't take over, due to their high levels of infertility. You just have to be careful and verify that you have caught a genuine crucian, if it was big enough to try and claim a record or a prize with it. Otherwise, if it looks like a crucian, then enjoy it as such. I've caught a few big fish that looked like crucians from a lake where carp and crucians hybridize, and if they look like crucians, then I considered them to be so. When my friend caught a potential club record from that water, we made sure we did a scale count and photographed the fish, and it was confirmed as a true crucian. We thought it was, because the hybrids looked exactly like F1s do now.

 

[smiffy]

Wasn’t the long-standing Crucian record discarded over doubts about its parentage. It must have fooled people for many years. I think the first two fish look like Crucians. But then, if a hybrid had been the record for many years

 

[Tinca Mad]

I hope to have a chance of catching one of these lovely fish some day.
As an aside, I found this video by Dr Paul Garner about his Crucian catches from Johnson's lake............

 

[WickerDave]

That's not a Crucian. It's certainly
Crucianish but there's some Carp in there somewhere.

I'm counting this one from a weedy club pool yesterday as genuine, my first for ages. It was a mistake to picture it with the sun on it though as it washed out the body and fin colours.

 

[Zerkalo]

@WickerDave this is a typical summer bag of what I call 'Crucians' from Hurst Farm. No idea if true or not.

 

[WickerDave]

@WickerDave this is a typical summer bag of what I call 'Crucians' from Hurst Farm. No idea if true or not.

They all look genuine to me , they look nothing like the brown ones I had there.

 

[Zerkalo]

I'm told the first two pics in the OP are too small to do a scale count or to send to the leading Crucian expert. But I'm also told that it's far harder to tell the difference between a Brown Goldfish hybrid and a Carp Hybrid and there are a load of Goldfish in Hurst.

 

[Total]

@Zerkalo .......Scale count on the lateral line indicates a true crucian mate....(I didn't count all scale patterns on every photo!)

 

[Zerkalo]

I remember when I did the report it was mentioned that I photograph every fish. I do when it comes to something as lovely as a Crucian.

 

[Zerkalo]

My dad just sent me this, another one came out of the park presumably today. From the lilies too where I plan to fish Sunday. Don't look quite as big though?

 

[Total]

^^...@Zerkalo .....Your Dad looks younger than I imagined Steve....

 

[Zerkalo]

^^...@Zerkalo .....Your Dad looks younger than I imagined Steve....

No I wasn't clear sorry... these are other anglers catches that he sees as he follows the park on FaceBook. This was caught by the angler today.

 

[Davethefish]

^^...@Zerkalo .....Your Dad looks younger than I imagined Steve....

Shotgun wedding Either that or Steve keeps him on his toes enough to prolong the Peter Pan gene

 

[Zerkalo]

This is dad.

 

[Total]

This is dad.

^^....Obviously the 'proper fisherman' in the family!

 

[Scardinius]

The first two carp in the pictures look like they have been taking PEDs to up their game when caught!

 

[The one and only Harvey]

I know of a farmpond with lots of crucians. They are tiny fish, just a few centimers long. No other fish in the pond. They have never been subject to predation. They look quite different from what you'de expect a crucian to look like. Almost all farmponds in my neck of the woods are populated by crucians, One pond I visited, close to the fjord, had crucians and eels. The crucians were all between 3.5 and 4 pounds. According to a local biologist, crucians were used as pest control by farmers. They eat the the mosquito larva, and keep the population of mosquitos low.

I'll catch a few of the tiny ones, and post photos.