stop a fish

Steve57

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I have no faith whatsoever in Middy top kits, I've had three or four of the GIS26 top kits just snap with elastics from a 10 hollow to 18 hollow with no more than 15 degrees between the rig line and the top kit.
 

Dave

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No. If the pole is pointing out at 90 degrees to the bank and the fish swims away parallel to the bank then the pole and elastic will also form a 90 degree angle. Swing the pole towards the fish reducing the angle between pole and bank to 45 degrees the angle between pole and elastic will increase to around 135 degrees.
Just for clarity, I've knocked up a quick sketch....


1661064984937.png
 

Neil ofthe nene

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Beat me to it Dave. I have added a couple of green lines and measured the angles to show the increase (142 being greater than 105) I am talking about.

Pole Angle Edited.png
 

Dave

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Another way of looking at it is the carbon is stretched more on the outside of the bend than it is on the inside of the bend. Rotate the pole at the same time as playing a fish and the carbon becomes twisted as the stretch is transferred.
The more bending and twisting you put into your top kits the more risk there is of them breaking, hence why when most tend to break they shatter and splinter rather than a clean break. The latter being more down to material weaknesses than stress imparted into the carbon section.
 

Stewie74

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I don't understand what you mean by shallower. The angle between pole and elastic gets greater. I am not talking about the angle between pole and bank.
Beat me to it Dave. I have added a couple of green lines and measured the angles to show the increase (142 being greater than 105) I am talking about.

Pole Angle Edited.png
Take your point about 142 being higher than 105, but if you progress your point then is a 180 degree angle (I.e. pole and elastic pointing straight ahead, like in pic 3 above) an increase or decrease in angle from the 90 degree right angle when the fish runs along the bank?

The more acute the angle, (and lower the number), the greater the angle. Increase the angle and the number goes down, and vice versa, at least until you go past 180 degrees.

Also, I think your calculations miss an important point about the distance a fish moves . The angle will change depending on distance from the pole tip, unless you’re fishing the mudline and the fish runs at a direct right angle and doesn’t come away from the bank.
 
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Lee Richards

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"Also, I think your calculations miss an important point about the distance a fish moves"

The speed will come into it as well.
If the fish moves very quickly and the elastic bottoms out accordingly a shock curvature on the pole or rod can weaken its integral strength - do that a few times and eventually the wall material will fracture.
 

JLK

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It generally boils down to being operator error. Can't see the point in getting hung up about top kit angles.
 

OldTaff

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Mostly I just hang in for grim death using an older pole built like a scaffolding tube :ROFLMAO:
 

stikflote

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Those video,s were very good but they didnt show a carp running straight donw the lake

i had no chance of stopping it
 

Lee Richards

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Doesn't haven't to be a big fish, all it has to be is a fish bigger than you are tackled up to cope with or the ability of the angler.
And even then a pole set-up should be able to handle more than you are fishing for.
 

JLK

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Agreed. There are always those Carp that steam off bu if you use balanced tackle you stand a chance of getting the rig back.
Too many people use hook lengths that are too heavy in relation to what they are fishing for.
If the op had used a hook length that was much lighter he may well have got his rig back intact.
I believe he was fishing straight through with no hook length.
 

Trent_Fisher

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I regularly fish the margins using 7/8lb n-gage straight through and have never once felt like my poke would snap on me. I don’t tend to use elastic as strong as the OP but I’d lean towards there being a fault with the top kit.
 

Neil ofthe nene

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Take your point about 142 being higher than 105, but if you progress your point then is a 180 degree angle (I.e. pole and elastic pointing straight ahead, like in pic 3 above) an increase or decrease in angle from the 90 degree right angle when the fish runs along the bank?

The more acute the angle, (and lower the number), the greater the angle. Increase the angle and the number goes down, and vice versa, at least until you go past 180 degrees.

Also, I think your calculations miss an important point about the distance a fish moves . The angle will change depending on distance from the pole tip, unless you’re fishing the mudline and the fish runs at a direct right angle and doesn’t come away from the bank.
Moot point as only an idiot will point the pole straight at the fish. I have done it when down to the topkit so the elstic has its whole length to work itself with no friction.
 

OldTaff

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Those video,s were very good but they didnt show a carp running straight donw the lake

i had no chance of stopping it

That’s just the way it goes sometimes and you were unlucky that the pole gave up - separate hooklength of a slightly lighter line would be my recommendation for future sessions as a safety net.

Hope you have some success when you contact the dealer or manufacturer - hopefully they can sort you out a replacement top kit.
 
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