Size 10 barbless rule

OldTaff

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Having caught numerous 12-14lb carp from my local (non commercial) lake on size 14 QM1’s then I can’t really see where I’d need to go bigger than a 10 in the same pattern since any fish big enough for more than that would smash up my mainline & rig.

Just how big are commercial fish these days ?
 

squimp

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Normally it's size 12 and when anglers use the equivalent in carp hooks which some brands are larger it's just another way of circumventing the rules ,and to honest i see it as cheating .

get me circumventing and equivalent in one sentence and no spell checker lol
If the hook is a size 12; how can that be classed as cheating ?

If the manufacturers are silly enough not to use a Standard hook size scale, then it isn’t the anglers that are to blame.

In fly fishing competitions hooks have to fit into a specific gape gauge - that solves your problem.

FWIW you can land almost anything on a decent size 10 or even 12 hook. I’ve lost count of the number of 20+ carp Ive caught by accident when feeder fishing for tench.

On the flip side, there is a commercial near me that may have really big perch in it. I won’t fish it as there is a max size 12 hook rule and that makes it tricky to use the big baits I would choose (to stop me catching roach etc etc).
 

abbo27

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You have to bear in mind when the size 10 rule came in on many commercials it was in the early day, quite a while ago. The reason was simple , to stop people dragging carp in and to protect the mouths of the fish, some of which were relatively small in size. Some also believe that smaller hooks reduce the potential of foul hooked fish.

Hook technology has moved on significantly, in the early days bigger hooks were often longer shanked than the hooks we use now and if you take a longer hook with a wider gape they are prone to keyholing. This is the widening of the hole at the point end due to the twisting and turning of the hook during the fight as the fish shakes it head and angles are changed during the fight.

If you've done a lot of chub fishing with big hooks and baits like cheese and bread on a size 4 and 6 it's likely you'll have suffered a number of lost fish over the years, however if you jumped in the hair rigging band wagon and started using smaller hooks such as a size 10, you'll have noticed a big improvement of fish hooked v fish lost/coming off.

For barbel chub and carp my preferred hook is the Guru MWG mainly in size 16-12, however I do have some 10's for barbel. It's hook I'm ultra confident in and I don't recollect having one straightened. Their hook holding power when tackling big fish is superb. It's their balance of strength, shape and wire gauge that makes them so effective. Narrower wire and lighter gauge high carbon hooks are more prone to springing and tearing the fishes mouth if a lot of pressure is applied so there is a balance that has to be achieved and although this can in some peoples eyes be detrimental to presentation, particularly on the pole, when it comes to big fish you have to be pragmatic in your approach.

I've never had any problem with the size 10 rule and considering the venues I fish such as Viaduct where you have a good chance of a 20lbs fish in a match, I'm more than happy with the tackle and approach I use and have never felt under gunned. I also don't feel that I'd gain any advantage in using a bigger hook as fish losses are minimal particularly when the fish are hooked in the mouth.
What would you recommend at Viaduct? I fish there and use size 16 QM1s for banded 6mm and 8mm as well as meat and corn on a quick stop tied to 0.17. Would going to a 14 reduce the number of bites or actually increase the number of bites to hooked fish ratio?
 

chris1967

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"In fly fishing competitions hooks have to fit into a specific gape gauge - that solves your problem."

couldn't agree with you more that one ,should be applied to all day ticket fisheries also ,depends on the capability of the angler i'm sure you'd be pi$$ed just as much as me landing a fish and having to remove the size 10 carp hook tied to 5lb hook length in its gob and how many do you see swimming around trailing the pole float behind it ,yes crack offs happen but then you remove the rig and see why its happened
 

squimp

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"In fly fishing competitions hooks have to fit into a specific gape gauge - that solves your problem."

couldn't agree with you more that one ,should be applied to all day ticket fisheries also ,depends on the capability of the angler i'm sure you'd be pi$$ed just as much as me landing a fish and having to remove the size 10 carp hook tied to 5lb hook length in its gob and how many do you see swimming around trailing the pole float behind it ,yes crack offs happen but then you remove the rig and see why its happened
That isn’t a tackle problem; it is an angler problem.

The size of the hook isn’t the problem, it’s the bloke holding the rod/pole and whether they are capable of landing the fish that they hook. Either thru lack of skill or just fishing much too light.
 

Silverfisher

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Agree with the above you've got to go some to break a 5lb hooklength on your fairly averaged commercial sized carp. A 12 hook to a 5lb hooklengths to 6lb mainline is pretty much my standard floater fishing set up for upper single to middle double carp and I don't think I've ever been broken off on that in fairly open water. Will sometimes go up to 8lb mainline and 6-7lb hooklength if it's snaggy though.
 

chefster

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For carp venues ,for fish between 5-20lb, on Pw, B+P, Method/hybrid, I use 6lb maxima mainline, Reflo 0.21(8lb15oz) Hooklength, usually QM1 size 10, never been broken , and suffer minimum hook pulls
 

chris1967

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That isn’t a tackle problem; it is an angler problem.

The size of the hook isn’t the problem, it’s the bloke holding the rod/pole and whether they are capable of landing the fish that they hook. Either thru lack of skill or just fishing much too light.
(y)
 

CJROSCOW

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Most of you who fish match waters will have come across the maximum size 10 barbless hook rule at some time.

The go to hook for bottom feeder/bomb fishing appears to have been the QM1 for years now and I have used these myself since they first came out.

With carp getting larger and larger in our commercial waters these days do any of you use hooks from the Korda/Fox range etc. that are much larger, but still a size 10 to comply with fishery rules? These larger hooks would enable you to use larger baits and use different presentations whilst still complying with the rules.

If so be nice to hear what you are using.
Im not sure there's anything swimming in britsh commercial waters I couldn't land with a sz 12 kammy animal
 

emmaemma

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I don't have any size 10s hooks but then again, I don't fish for specimen fish but have caught many double fish on hooks much smaller than this.
 

stephanie

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i dont have any size 10 hooks at all for me i tend to concentrate more on matching the hook to the bait size. paste will be a 12 on average same with double 8mm pellet 14 on 6mm 18 on 4mm and so on
 

The Landlord

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I've got a load of Kamasan size 11 B711's that came with a job lot of tackle. Unusual size?
 

dave brittain 1

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What would you recommend at Viaduct? I fish there and use size 16 QM1s for banded 6mm and 8mm as well as meat and corn on a quick stop tied to 0.17. Would going to a 14 reduce the number of bites or actually increase the number of bites to hooked fish ratio?
If you're happy with 0.17 and a 16 QM1 stick with it as confidence plays a big part in fishing and swapping and changing can cause untold problems particularly if your confidence is dented.

If I'm feeding 6mm or 8mm pellets I generally start on 0.17 and a 16 MWG. However if I draw well or start catching well I would have no hesitation in stepping up to 0.19 to a 14 MWG s I always have a duplicate heavier rig set up. On meat, it's usually close in work in the last two hours. With this and margin work I'll fish 0.19 and a 14 MWG noting on meat I use a banded hair rig and pull the band into the meat.

On the lead I fish 0.21 to a 14 MWG particularly on Carey.

My approach may sound heavy however Viaduct is a specialised venue where the fish are big and you need to play the percentages game. Unlike most venues you're only fishing for 4-5 bites an hour so when you hook one, you need to get it in.
 

Line Clip

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For carp venues ,for fish between 5-20lb, on Pw, B+P, Method/hybrid, I use 6lb maxima mainline, Reflo 0.21(8lb15oz) Hooklength, usually QM1 size 10, never been broken , and suffer minimum hook pulls
That surprised me a bit chef a 6lbs main line considering the size of fish, I would rather fish with a 6lbs main line myself but ( I use Preston feeder 8lbs )
6 lbs is more supple and casts better I think, but always thought 8lbs to be right strength with a 6lbs + hook length
I use a Preston Supera rod would I be better off using 6lbs then ,always thought the hook length was a step down rather than a step up.
 

chefster

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That surprised me a bit chef a 6lbs main line considering the size of fish, I would rather fish with a 6lbs main line myself but ( I use Preston feeder 8lbs )
6 lbs is more supple and casts better I think, but always thought 8lbs to be right strength with a 6lbs + hook length
I use a Preston Supera rod would I be better off using 6lbs then ,always thought the hook length was a step down rather than a step up.
It’s a bit different with modern lines maxima line in 6lb is 0.23, I think, and the Reflo is 0.21, so in effect is balanced, also I don’t really feel the need to step up the mainline, if I had problems, I would....For instance on the bagging wag, when casting 4-5 oz loaded floats I use ESP Syncro HT in 10lb, which is 0.33, then I use a 0.24 (11lb b.s.)Reflo Hooklength.....
 
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bluemack

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Landed a good number of Barbel and large Barbel too on 16/14 Drennan specialist hooks and pulled out of none to date on them. Given how they fight and the river strength, the line and rods being used, emphasises to me that size isn't everything.
Spot on mate,i almost always use a 16 Kamasan Animal for Barbel,great hooks and can,t remember the last Barbel i lost.
 
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