Size 10 barbless rule

Maverick

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Most of you who fish match waters will have come across the maximum size 10 barbless hook rule at some time.

The go to hook for bottom feeder/bomb fishing appears to have been the QM1 for years now and I have used these myself since they first came out.

With carp getting larger and larger in our commercial waters these days do any of you use hooks from the Korda/Fox range etc. that are much larger, but still a size 10 to comply with fishery rules? These larger hooks would enable you to use larger baits and use different presentations whilst still complying with the rules.

If so be nice to hear what you are using.
 

Lee Richards

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Does it matter what others are using as surely if you are asking the question you are trying to validate what you can get away with?

It's what you choose to use on the waters you fish that apply the said rule that matters.
 

Northantslad

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Think there is a reason that the typical and popular coarse (as opposed to specimen) hooks still have popularity, QM1s, PR36/38 (now revamped/renamed), B911s, they all are strong for their size and in achieving strength for a relatively thin gauge.

Specimen hooks are yes, larger for a given size comparison, but crucially thicker gauge, which would if used for coarse fishing/match fishing, affect presentation of the typically smaller baits. The only bait it may have less of an impact on, is perhaps paste, where the hook is buried.

Have to factor in too, the equipment being used, if elastic or rod choice is correct, then its quite surprising what can be landed and effectively.
Big fish then big hook isn't necessarily the rule.
 

ukzero1

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On waters with the 'size 10' rule, I use the Kamasan B911, be it either the standard B911, or if it warrants it, the B911 X-Strong. Both eyed for hair rigging.
 

chefster

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I always use a QM1, as big as I can get away with, so usually a 10, on method/Hybrid, bomb, PW, I used to use smaller sizes, but suffered fish losses, changing to a bigger hook reduced this
 

chris1967

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Most of you who fish match waters will have come across the maximum size 10 barbless hook rule at some time.

The go to hook for bottom feeder/bomb fishing appears to have been the QM1 for years now and I have used these myself since they first came out.

With carp getting larger and larger in our commercial waters these days do any of you use hooks from the Korda/Fox range etc. that are much larger, but still a size 10 to comply with fishery rules? These larger hooks would enable you to use larger baits and use different presentations whilst still complying with the rules.

If so be nice to hear what you are using.
Normally it's size 12 and when anglers use the equivalent in carp hooks which some brands are larger it's just another way of circumventing the rules ,and to honest i see it as cheating .

get me circumventing and equivalent in one sentence and no spell checker lol
 

Silverfisher

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Only big hook stillwater fishing I’ve done is surface fishing which can need a 10 or 12 with bread for which I tend to use drennan wide gapes. It’s admittedly not for particularly big fish, I guess 10-15lb, but still they do the job. Key is to not use a too harsh rod so the tip can cushion the forces rather than the hook. Have also used the same hooks for live baiting for Perch on rivers occasionally and they’ll hold the odd decent fluked pike as well.
 

robert d

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Most of you who fish match waters will have come across the maximum size 10 barbless hook rule at some time.

The go to hook for bottom feeder/bomb fishing appears to have been the QM1 for years now and I have used these myself since they first came out.

With carp getting larger and larger in our commercial waters these days do any of you use hooks from the Korda/Fox range etc. that are much larger, but still a size 10 to comply with fishery rules? These larger hooks would enable you to use larger baits and use different presentations whilst still complying with the rules.

If so be nice to hear what you are using.
Never gone that big ,i usually use a 16 or 14 , reading a few posts i will have to try bigger ,its a confidence thing for me . I look at a wide gape 14 and think its a bit big lol. It also depends on bait size and whether its hard pellets or softer bait or a wafter of some sort .
 

Northantslad

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Landed a good number of Barbel and large Barbel too on 16/14 Drennan specialist hooks and pulled out of none to date on them. Given how they fight and the river strength, the line and rods being used, emphasises to me that size isn't everything.
 

chefster

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Never gone that big ,i usually use a 16 or 14 , reading a few posts i will have to try bigger ,its a confidence thing for me . I look at a wide gape 14 and think its a bit big lol. It also depends on bait size and whether its hard pellets or softer bait or a wafter of some sort .
If you aren’t having problems with the sizes you’re using, then no problem, I was losing a percentage of fish through hook pulls, Paul Holland said use the biggest hook you can get away with, a QM1, size 10 is perfect for wafters, I use a spike with those...... And a band with 6 and 8 mm pellets , doesn’t seem to reduce bites 🤷‍♂️
 

robert d

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Landed a good number of Barbel and large Barbel too on 16/14 Drennan specialist hooks and pulled out of none to date on them. Given how they fight and the river strength, the line and rods being used, emphasises to me that size isn't everything.
I know Steve Ringer doesn't mess about with hooks or hooks line ect , or Will Raison , i think its a try method with bigger hooks on the venues you fish , the ones i fish most theyre a bit cagey but when theyre having it a bigger hook might be worth a go.
 

Northantslad

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Yes, noticed that Rob with many of the famous names, especially when they are talking margin rigs and with regard to line diameters especially.
 

Silverfisher

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Never gone that big ,i usually use a 16 or 14 , reading a few posts i will have to try bigger ,its a confidence thing for me . I look at a wide gape 14 and think its a bit big lol. It also depends on bait size and whether its hard pellets or softer bait or a wafter of some sort .
I know what you mean. I’m used to 18s and 16s so when I use 14s they look massive in some guises let alone 12s. Last time I used a 12 was about 2.5 years ago mind you!
 

robert d

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If you aren’t having problems with the sizes you’re using, then no problem, I was losing a percentage of fish through hook pulls, Paul Holland said use the biggest hook you can get away with, a QM1, size 10 is perfect for wafters, I use a spike with those...... And a band with 6 and 8 mm pellets , doesn’t seem to reduce bites 🤷‍♂️
Yes agree Chef ,will try a bigger hook ,i have lost fish that cost me a win on a few occasions
 

robert d

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Yes agree Chef ,will try a bigger hook ,i have lost fish that cost me a win on a few occasions
I think length of hair makes a massive difference on smaller hooks ,its no good having an 8mm pellet sat tight to the hook on an 18 for example . If you can get them to take on a bigger hook its got to help .
 

chefster

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I think length of hair makes a massive difference on smaller hooks ,its no good having an 8mm pellet sat tight to the hook on an 18 for example . If you can get them to take on a bigger hook its got to help .
The thing is a size 10 QM1 counterbalances a 6 or 8mm wafter perfectly, and an 8mm pellet is not a delicate bait .
 

dave brittain 1

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You have to bear in mind when the size 10 rule came in on many commercials it was in the early day, quite a while ago. The reason was simple , to stop people dragging carp in and to protect the mouths of the fish, some of which were relatively small in size. Some also believe that smaller hooks reduce the potential of foul hooked fish.

Hook technology has moved on significantly, in the early days bigger hooks were often longer shanked than the hooks we use now and if you take a longer hook with a wider gape they are prone to keyholing. This is the widening of the hole at the point end due to the twisting and turning of the hook during the fight as the fish shakes it head and angles are changed during the fight.

If you've done a lot of chub fishing with big hooks and baits like cheese and bread on a size 4 and 6 it's likely you'll have suffered a number of lost fish over the years, however if you jumped in the hair rigging band wagon and started using smaller hooks such as a size 10, you'll have noticed a big improvement of fish hooked v fish lost/coming off.

For barbel chub and carp my preferred hook is the Guru MWG mainly in size 16-12, however I do have some 10's for barbel. It's hook I'm ultra confident in and I don't recollect having one straightened. Their hook holding power when tackling big fish is superb. It's their balance of strength, shape and wire gauge that makes them so effective. Narrower wire and lighter gauge high carbon hooks are more prone to springing and tearing the fishes mouth if a lot of pressure is applied so there is a balance that has to be achieved and although this can in some peoples eyes be detrimental to presentation, particularly on the pole, when it comes to big fish you have to be pragmatic in your approach.

I've never had any problem with the size 10 rule and considering the venues I fish such as Viaduct where you have a good chance of a 20lbs fish in a match, I'm more than happy with the tackle and approach I use and have never felt under gunned. I also don't feel that I'd gain any advantage in using a bigger hook as fish losses are minimal particularly when the fish are hooked in the mouth.
 

crumpercatcher.

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I will use the biggest carp hook in a size 10 I have, usually for fishing a big lobworm or whole prawn for big perch. I am trying to hook and land my target species and put off non perch if possible.
 

mickthechippy

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about the only time I use size 10 or 12 hooks is using worm, flake or crust on the river for old rubber lips

14 is about the biggest I go on commies when using a method feeder
 

The Landlord

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If you aren’t having problems with the sizes you’re using, then no problem, I was losing a percentage of fish through hook pulls, Paul Holland said use the biggest hook you can get away with, a QM1, size 10 is perfect for wafters, I use a spike with those...... And a band with 6 and 8 mm pellets , doesn’t seem to reduce bites 🤷‍♂️
Stupidly, I never even considered hook size to be a factor in suffering hook pulls. I rarely use bigger than a 16 but will use a 12 for paste. Food for thought.
 
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