Ide and roach hybrids

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sully

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just been fishing at our club pond (cypranies A.C. north somercoates,lincolnshire )approx 1000 ide were introduced during the week, and we had some conflicting disscusions, some said ide won't breed in still water, and others said we will end up with roach/ide hybrids.
just wondering if anybody, could shed some more light on the matter.
thanks sully[:D]

P.S what are peoples feelings on introducing barbel into stillwater fisheries [?]
 

esox.20

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Oh boy sully!!!!! you've opened a can of worms with that question of stocking Barbel in still waters.Get out your fireproof undies and take a step backwards. I wish you all the best

chill out go fishing
 

esox.20

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Had another thought, how did you manage to get a sec.30 consent for the introduction of Ide to this lake?

chill out go fishing
 

sully

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quote:Originally posted by esox.20

Had another thought, how did you manage to get a sec.30 consent for the introduction of Ide to this lake?

chill out go fishing
got me on that one,what is sec.30 consent, sully
 

esox.20

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Its the relevant permission from the Enviroment Agency (EA) for the transfer of fish. Its to prevent the transfer of disease or illegal movement of fish.
I'm not being critical on the introduction of Ide just down right nosey. This may have a bearing on something I have in mind for the future.

chill out go fishing
 

scoobs11

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i have no problems with introducing barbel to ponds sully.

in fact the only one i'v ever caught came from a pond in a match.

[}:)]

i'll have a fiver on the brown one
 

MALC

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John,

Around here some unscrupulous fishery owners and sellers tend to get their Section 30 by labelling Ide as Roach (as they are similar when small).

Thats when they even bother with a section 30 which we all know a fair few still don't bother with or even in some circumstances get the section 30 for X amount then actually put a lot more in the venue.

One venue not far from me uptill this year never contained any Ide then suddenly after a fresh stock of "ROACH" were introduced every body was suddenly catching IDE (bit suspicious or what).

Sully,

I'm with Scoobs regards Barbel in stillwaters, (and i grew up catching them on the River Kennet).
The way the rivers are going at present the day will come when most people will only be able to catch a barbel from a Stillwater.





MALC
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Trogg

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BARBEL, STILL WATERS ARRRRRRRGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Why put a fish that is designed more than any other to live in a flowing water into a still water???

Chub were introduced to still waters & being the hardy fish they are have adapted to it, Barbus barbus on the other hand have never been proven to breed in still waters.

A certain well known angling group claimed their barbel have bred but it just so happened that they claimed that shortly after a lorry load of fish were delivered to the same water the barbel were in.

Oh & a sec30 consent is needed before ANY fish can be moved from one place to another,even if the waters are on the same piece of land.

Alan

Just cos i ain't postin, it don't mean i ain't watchin
 
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sully

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Thanks for the input lads, regarding the barbel as the replies have been fairly positive i'll come clean [:I]
about 200 barbel were introduced about 3 months ago to see how they faired out , they were about 150mm long one or two were caught at the weekend now about 300mm long and about 1/2pound in wieght so they seem to be developing nicely, which brings me to another topic amongst our members regarding keep-nets, at the moment we don't put them in our nets which leaves some of the members disgruntled
their argument is that barbel get very stressed when caught and putting them in nets helps them calm down, is this true i don't know cos i'm not a barbel expert, any comments ?
as regarding section 30, we are a syndicate pond and have a committee
running affairs so i assume every thing is done properly but i will check

sully [:D](phew !! this is my longest post yet)
 

Trogg

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Sully please don't ever put a barbus into a keepnet, this is the quickest way of making them go "belly up".

A barbus needs a good strong flow, it also needs a strong flowing water running over gravel to breed, basically your money (the syndicates) has been wasted by buying fish that will live their lives out then die because they can't breed.

Oh & they won't live a long life because the won't be able to use their muscles properly, the muscles are what make them such a hard fighting fish (a 5lb barbus will fight as hard as any 10lb cyprinid)

Alan

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Peter

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Is it safe to come out yet!!!!

Peter.

Make Friends,Go Maggotdrowning.
 

MALC

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Is it Sully or "Sneaky"


Never had a problem with putting barbel in a Keepnet myself and nowadays with most nets being of the closed mesh carp sack type in some instances a stay in a keepnet might do them more good than returning them straight to the water (as they can go belly up if not returned properly).


But bear in mind i mainly fish matches so 99% of fish go straight into my keepnet.

Although i will admit in the past i have asked for Bigger Barbel,Carp & Pike to be weighed in straight away and then returned them to the water (as i've felt they were to big to go in the net).

A lot of people that are against Barbel in keepnets do so due to the fact that the spine on the front of their Dorsal fin can get caught in the mesh (same with carp) but cases of this are almost nile now due to advances in materials used.


quote:Chub were introduced to still waters & being the hardy fish they are have adapted to it, Barbus barbus on the other hand have never been proven to breed in still waters.
Not wanting to be controversial but
what difference does it make if they spawn in lakes or not.

People are happy to catch Hybrids yet there is no proof that they breed either same goes for Sterlet and Sturgeon as well as Stockie Trout.

And what about Eels they dont breed in lakes [;)] but we still fish for them


Now it's my turn to duck [;)][;)][;)][;)]



MALC
IT'S CATCHING
 

MALC

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Forgot about Grass Carp they dont breed in this country either.

MALC
IT'S CATCHING
 

Trogg

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tut tut malc,

stockie trout are bred for one purpose food whether for me [:D] or predators they are still food.

There was some talk of sturgeon in a certain fishery not a million miles from me breeding (sterlet, well they're roughly the same thing).

Grassies have been known to breed in the UK although i will admit the young didn't last (as far as i know).

Certain Hybrids do indeed breed but i can't remember which ones.

Wheres the Cyp kid when you need him [;)]



Alan

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Peter

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quote:whether for me[:D]or predators

There's a difference???????

Peter.

Make Friends,Go Maggotdrowning.
 

MALC

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Interested in which Hybrids breed as every thing i've read have said they dont (some thing to do latter).

Regards the Sterlets, near me is a aquatic shop and fish farm (A5 Aquatics) and they have been trying to breed both Sturgeon and Sterlet for around 7 years with no success (yet).

About 10 years ago i managed to get Grassies to lay eggs in a tank but had to run temps as if it were a tropical setup but they never hatched, (unlike my SERRASALMUS NATTERERI) had a batch of 50 survive (and people worry about Zander)[;)]



MALC
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Peter

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No wonder you like fishing with MEAT Malc[:D][:D][:D]

Peter.

Make Friends,Go Maggotdrowning.
 

sully

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wow !!!
should of kept my zipper closed, but surely thats what these forums are all about? personally i didn't agree with the barbel being introduced into the pond but the descision was made through a vote
i suppose people who can't travel to the rivers etc.. can have the experiance of catching a variety of different fish all in the one place.
sully (cyp kid)
 

MALC

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Peter, got it in one.
They are lovely misunderstood fish (bit like me LOL)

Alan,
I'm bored now as ive just spent over 1hr searching for info on Hybrids (sad or what) with no luck......

But for anyone who is looking to stock their waters the following link will be very helpfull CLICK HERE

I'm going to bed now.

MALC
IT'S CATCHING
 

Trogg

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I'll have to see if i can find the bits on hybrids breeding.
(Malc what kind of temps were you having to run for Grassies to lay the eggs??)

My common channel cat was laying eggs all the flaming time then she suddenly stopped but i never heated the water, i wonder if they'd have survived had i let them get fertilised??


Peter are those vegitarian pirhana??


Cyp, crafty git [;)]

& now i'm off to work [:(]



Alan

Just cos i ain't postin, it don't mean i ain't watchin
 
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